IMO unfair critique to TL, and more constructive suggestions for TL and the forum

[Clark_Wayne]

Would never say better!

I'm a long timer player also, playing since the beginning.. And honestly, like you said, TL has been done changes and added things to the game that are impossible to do! The last one that TL has done, at least to me, was with the Pigmy goal, I was collecting the rest of the food taht was enough to complete the goal to get Pigmy in the last couple of minutes but I didn't received the Pigmy! I've sent an email to TL right after this happened and guess what? The problem is still not solved! I've sudmitted the request on May 26! It has been 1 week! I already had problems with other games and the problem was solved in less time.

The constantly changes with the elements behavior in the battles were horrible! The impossible timed goals from the Tournaments where the Flash Tournament has a duration of 32hrs and TL makes the incubation of the animal reward impossible to win and hatch the Tournament without spending gems!

And still there are players that defend TL? Oh god, you are so blind. The time will come to you and show that TL is not what you think. TL needs money to leave? Of course they do, I know that, I know that programmig is hard, but doing a game impossible and only possible if we spent gems? Nop, TL can do better and proof of that is the game Dragon Story that honestly is more fair than this game and both of this games are exactly the game. In DS there are a lot of players that spend money in it and TL doesn't need to make the game impossible and unfair so the players spent money in it. Since FFS is becoming a horrible game it's normal and I understand that the players are starting to leave the game and starting to not spent any more money in this game.

When a game is a piece of cr*p and they continue to do more cr*p, it's normal that the players leave the game and start criticizing it. Zenobia? Oh boy! Zenobia was one of the best players that TL could EVER HAD and what did TL about that? NOTHING, they ignored us, players, they didn't care about our opinions, honestly? The staff from the forum is more helpful and communicative with us than the real TL staff does! A couple of the admins from here are normal players like us, I think, at least is what is seems to be, and Kooky is the one that helps a lot in here! maguar already saw a couple of times helping, and FrozenTurtle also.

Honeslty, if this game was fair like DS is, the long time players had never leaved this game, more players would start to spent money on it and there wasn't so many critics about this game. DS is more possible to finish things than FFS is, and both games have the same mechanism.

Agreed !
I play DS and FFS, and DS players are better treated than in FFS
I'm not as frustrated when i'm playing DS ( i enjoy playing DS ! ) as i'm when i'm playing FFS. And i did enjoy when i started FFS, but now...

[ogreve]

Hi all,

Thanks for all the input, it certainly helps to give me a bit more insight in where the grounds of the complaints tend to come from!

My main point with the initial post was (and still is) that to the newer players it comes across as off-putting when each topic about a new animal and/or tournament has so many comments where the "gem spending aspect" is criticised. That is the part where I say: o.k., obviously TL does that to make money of the game, and it is your own choice whether you want to actually spend those gems or not.
Just like mentioned in one of the last posts, I too cannot understand why any individual player would want to spend thousands of Dollars on a single game, for me spending such amounts of money (even if I were in a position to do so) is over the top and it wouldn't make me feel as if I would have achieved anything with the game. Still, it's their own choice. If they can and want to afford spending that much, they can do so. I don't think TL will get the expectation from those extremes that everybody will start spending such amounts.
There are two money making business models that could be aimed for here: getting either few players to spend high amounts of money, or getting many people to spend small amounts. They could both add up to similar totals, but I think generally spoken for things like Lamborghinis etc. the former works better, and for iOS games the latter seems the smarter choice.

I recognise several of the complaints made in this thread from my own experiences with a different game.
Up until some 2 years ago I was really hooked on the game Monster Life. Gameloft had a smart tactic: apart from crystal sales, they would also have weekly animal sales. A major difference is that in Monster Life animals could not be bred, so buying them was the only option. Some of them could only be bought with vast amounts of crystals (the most expensive animal at full cost would set you back 2400 crystals) and until the tournaments were added to that game, you could never earn that amount of crystals in the game, unless you bought them. What Gameloft did though, was to even include that very rarest animal from time to time in a sale with a 90% discount, making that animal only cost 240 crystals at that time. Often of course this followed about a day after a crystal sale would end. I bet you that a LOT of people (me included) several times made use of a crystal sale, for the moment that the animal sale would be coming up, hoping there to be something rare in it at a good price.
That really did get me to spend money several times and then afterwards to still feel good about it, because I had then managed to get an otherwise unobtainable animal at a good price.
What went wrong with Monster Life? I don't know why, but for some reason at the height of the success (and this was not that long after they won a "number 1 game award" for it!) Gameloft seemed to have completely dropped all work on it, whilst they did continue to add new things to e.g. the My Little Pony game (which my daughter at that time also played). So there I was. I had managed to acquire ALL animals in the game (with NO exceptions), I had all of the land expansions, everything was full with top level buildings (not crystal bought ones though), sitting on a pile of over 3000 crystals, that were partially bought with real money and partially earned through very extensive tournament battling and nothing new appeared anymore. Guess what I did after that situation was still like that some two months later. And then, guess what happened to Monster Life? The other day my daughter wanted to install it again from scratch on the iPad and it appears it's not even available anymore in the App Store. Quite to the contrary of FFS the reason that caused me stop playing Monster Life was that there was really nothing more to do, other than senseless money collecting and tournament fighting. There were no more land expansions and no more monsters to be obtained. Even then I hated making the decision to call it a day.

So, even though my point about not liking to see constant complaints about "the gem spending" still stands, I do understand (and recognise) some of the other comments that were made somewhat better now. I agree with you all that customer care is a very important thing: the customers do have the power to make or break companies (as per the "capitalism comments" that were made earlier in this thread, which in Europe are recognisable too ). It would be unwise to not address fair issues of players. Of course they cannot accommodate every thing that is being reported as an "issue", but e.g. the Pigmy example that was made is something to address.

Another thing which is also important for TL to know, is that the long term users are the more likely ones to actually spend gems on content, as long as the amounts are fair and the game stays fun. I mentioned this in my initial post too, and that too has not changed. The above made Monster Life comparison should make clear to TL just WHY it is important to get those advanced players to remain interested too. I first played FFS in August or September 2014, but that was only very occasionally when my 7 year old daughter called in my help. The both of us didn't start to play it extensively until around mid February. Last week the main account reached level 40 and my next upcoming expansion will require 34 realm runes. The amount of actual game play is rapidly decreasing for me too, and that is a thing which I hope is something that TL will actually at some point pay attention to. If they can make some small changes, such that the game remains "playable in a fun way" because significant progress can still be made in reasonable amounts of time for advanced players too, then that will only be so much the better for their business model too.
After all... just how tempted wouldn't I get to buy a gem pack soon if something like a gem or treasure animal goes on sale with e.g. a 75% discount relative to the normal gem amount... I would really like to get them through breeding though, and possibly use gems for occasionally using an ultimate attack when in trouble in a tournament, but I would definitely be very tempted to buy one of them at such a sale, as it would open up a new array of game options for me (particularly a gem animal, of course). As it stands I've had countless fails on trying to breed a unicorn and also on trying to breed a treasure animal. It would be so nice to finally get one, especially through breeding.

Here's some "positive note advice" on how I go about it:
Fortunately there are still quite a few less rare animal gaps to fill for me, and quite a few of those are currently getting filled by the "fails" of my (carefully chosen!) "Conduktor-Planther breeding attempts at getting a Unicorn". Yesterday was good: the 13 hours timer was not yet another Conduktor, but FINALLY the Sea Horse! \O/ YAY! \O/
I previously tried quite a few times for that one and for the Ocean Owl too (which I still don't have). Also, yesterday I got my biggest Gold Lion from level 13 to 14 and it just received it's 3rd feeding to push it to the point where it can evolve to epic level.

In the above I have found a strategy to keep "constructively busy" at useful stuff, without getting frustrated over gem or treasure breeding attempt fails.

My main missions/strategy that will see me well occupied for weeks to come (at times that no particular quest or so is on) can then be summarised as follows:
1-Do 24/7 4-element breeding as much as possible, and whenever possible using combinations that can also result in "reward animals" to be bred. A good example is the Punk Skunk that was released yesterday: I don't want to bother with Pandaffodil-Skyger breeding, but just make sure that my 4-element attempts include the nature and dark elements.
2-Try to make as many as possible of those attempts with at least the water and nature elements involved in it, so the Ocean Owl can result as a "fail" (ahem!) outcome, and so I can also try for the Treasure Toucan.
3-I currently still have the Pigmy and Dread Panda eggs in storage to hatch. I'm waiting for a large gap between an ongoing egg hatching time and a breeding time. I have a 7 hour gap coming up around midnight today, I may put that towards either of them (most likely the Dread Panda), though I would love to see a 45 hour breeding timer appear soon, so I would have plenty of time to hatch both of them, which is what I have been holding them back for...
4-Get as many of my "super rares" up to epic levels, in such a way that I get as many as possible different element combinations at epic level. This, of course, is a strategic move to be better prepared for the tournaments.
5-Get as many land expansions as possible, so I can optimally make use of habitats and animals in them.
6-Do as many as possible "low cost" feeding of lower level animals, such that they make money more quickly, which in turn allows me to gain more money in shorter time, and that allows me to every night plant Nexus Nuts, and wake up to having 4800 food available for point number 4.
7-Towards points 4 and 6: try to plant Power Pears as often as possible during the waking hours. I can often just hook my iPhone up to the computer via the USB cable for power and then just make sure the screen doesn't go black, then pretty much each 3 minutes I plant the Power Pears, lay the phone next to the computer (such that the farms are visible) and when I see the apples appear, collect them and make a new iteration. This is something I can combine in an unobtrusive way with work and when not in the presence of others, of course (as it would then look silly, IMO :P ). At moments that this can't be done that way, I just try to make a different smart harvesting choice, like planting Charm Cherries.

So, though I too am facing the difficulties of slow expansions etc. I decided to base my game play around the above 7 points. This should still see me well occupied for quite a few weeks, especially as other things like tournaments, limited animals, quests, etc. can come between points 1 and 2.

Forests like Zenobia's one are so beautiful, I wished mine were only half as nice. I also now wished I had picked up the game actively back in 2014, so I would have had a chance at the previous tournaments, world events and limited animals. Zenobia also added so many great informative posts here. It's so sad to see the 'bye' text on her forest now. Particularly for her own sake it would have been so much nicer if she could have found a way to not be frustrated over the things that caused her to quit, but well, I'm sure she had her own good reasons for quitting, despite new content being added. Many thanks, and all the praise in the world for having done so well on the game and having been such a role model!

Well, this post has drifted a lot. I do still hope that at least the "gem spending complaints" get aired less in the threads that treat actual game play topics. It's fine of course if they're aired in topics like this one you're reading now, as that one is explicitly about complaints, etc.

To conclude on a positive note:
Again, I'd like to thank you all for your opinions and new insights!
I hope everyone, including the long term players, can find some way to still get fun out of the game. Towards that end maybe there is some strategy for you too, similar to the mentioned "7 steps" that I now do. Hopefully that will give some focus and something concrete to work and focus on, with at least some successes and progress as outcome, instead of only having failures as outcomes of breeding attempts...

Cheers,
Olafo

[Jennerwein1]

Olafo, your analysis is very thoughtful and thorough. I have been through most of your suggestions. Planting mainly Nexus nuts, because 1. I cannot log in that often and 2. I have over 150 Mio to spend ( and growing).
This game used to be fun when there was some positive reinforcement, but even Pavlov's dog will stop salivating when the reward is too scarce.
DS and CS are way more fair and enjoyable, so I am willing to spend a reasonable amount of money there.
I will continue to post critical (and positive) remarks, not to be negative, but in the hope that TL will listen and this game will go on and improve.

[readysetgo888]

I'm pleased to see there are still many here that will still criticize TL after all....

Are you kidding? Creating new animals in an already existing application is not so difficult. It is just duplication.

Thank you so much for this comment!!! I don't understand how there are some players who don't realize how little work this game truly requires on the part of developers. Recoloring an animal and re-releasing it with a different name probably takes them about 10 minutes. Seriously. And many of the animals, they haven't even bothered to even kind of disguise the fact that all they have done is recolor it! I will never forget the Yule "Mule" that they were too lazy to take the antlers off of when they cloned it from the Reindeer. Seriously, how lazy can they be. And yet they probably earned thousands of dollars off that animal.

Yes, sometimes TL is creative and comes up with more interesting and unique designs for the animals, but the incredibly lazy clone animals that they spend 10 minutes copying and releasing, and then make thousands and thousands of dollars for that particular animal... that does bug me a lot. Yeah, sorry. Of all the companies one could feel sympathy for, this is not it, I promise.

[Jennerwein1]

"Yes, sometimes TL is creative and comes up with more interesting and unique designs for the animals, but the incredibly lazy clone animals that they spend 10 minutes copying and releasing, and then make thousands and thousands of dollars for that particular animal... that does bug me a lot. Yeah, sorry. Of all the companies one could feel sympathy for, this is not it, I promise." Posted by Readysetgo88



At least it makes it less frustrating for me when I don't get the clone. (Cheaper,too)

[rjazz]

There's good stuff & bad stuff about the game. On the whole I really like it - here comes the but... but it's getting boring with such long breeding, evolving times. You can have nothing to do for days at a time-just planting & maybe breeding once or twice. I want to be able to do something! And not all at once. I just started on DS and there is much more to do on a daily basis-not just when they are having events.

[55lee55]

Okay, some things written in this thread I agree with and some I don't.

I don't have the time, energy, or desire to go through all of the comments and leave my own. None of my opinions will change the way anyone feels about this subject.

So, let me give you a fact, not an opinion. I am telling the truth, and if you wish you can look at my Forest.

I have been here from the beginning like some of those who have commented here. With the exception of the Shockatoo which I am still trying to breed, I have every animal that has been released. If you don't see one in my forest, it means one of two things. It is either in my storage waiting for me to finish breeding all available animals because it is an animal I won on a tournament so I keep my nest open for breeding until I catch up, or it is evolving.

I have been very lucky with this game and yes, I have spent gems, usually to speed tournaments, but sometimes to speed breeding when an animal is first released. If I don't breed it fairly soon after the release time I usually stop speeding and wait until I my luck kicks in.

What does this prove? Nothing except that every animal that has been released was available at some point because I have it in my forest. Someone, in this instance me, has been able to obtain these animals either by breeding or winning tournaments. I am not the only player who has a full album. These are the facts, from my point of view.

Yes, I have opinions and speculations as to why some people are unable to breed certain animals no matter how hard they try. I believe that some try very hard and still cannot breed the animals they are trying to obtain. I believe this is extremely frustrating to them and discouraging to those who are also trying without success. I have seen many long time players give up and leave. I have observed changes in rules in the middle of the game.

Do I get annoyed when new players complain about all of the complaints? Well, yeah. Can I do anything about any of this? Absoulutely not.

So you can take the fact that I have all of the animals as proof that for me, at some point in time, I was able to obtain them all. I have spent gems. I have had animals that were extremely difficult to breed. Many people have no treasure animals, yet I have two of each, the maximum allowed by the game. I just recently bred my second Golden Retriever which was my fall-back breeding attempt for a long time. It can be done. I can state this because I did it.

But, does my success prove that everyone has the same chance to succeed in this game? We have all seen those who fail time after time. Of course I failed to breed most animals the first try, so I was not a success for most of the animals until I did breed them.

But what about those who don't/can't/couldn't breed them? I will leave that discussion to others. I will say that success in this game, for me personally, seems to be a matter of luck as opposed to a matter of perseverance. No, I haven't given up, but I might give up when I reach a point where I am unable to breed limited animals within the time they are offered and/or I lose tournaments.

We all have reasons why we continue to play any game, and my personal motivation to play FFS is to maintain a full album. I will definitely stay, despite what may appear to me to be a history of unfair rule changes, because I still have a chance to catch up and regain my full album. If that changes I may follow in the footsteps of many old-timers. But I will leave for my own reasons, as everyone who has left has left for theirs.

[ogreve]

Hi,

I did just sent a "friend request" (coming from 'ogreve').
Not that I don't believe you and want to see it as "evidence", but just because I love seeing those maxed out forests with (close to) ALL animals in them! I'm looking forward to seeing yours.
It's also very encouraging to hear that you have managed to breed the ultra rares too, despite being extremely advanced and despite having spent gems from time to time. I too think it's all mere luck and that TL simply uses a common "randomiser strategy" for generating a number, which will then determine what the outcome of the breeding will be. It's possible to implement far further going checks (like the amount of available gems, etc.) and other "seeding" criteria, but I doubt they would do so. They would certainly shoot themselves in the foot if THAT ever came out...

Cheers,
Olafo

[55lee55]

,l

Hi,

I did just sent a "friend request" (coming from 'ogreve').
Not that I don't believe you and want to see it as "evidence", but just because I love seeing those maxed out forests with (close to) ALL animals in them! I'm looking forward to seeing yours.
It's also very encouraging to hear that you have managed to breed the ultra rares too, despite being extremely advanced and despite having spent gems from time to time. I too think it's all mere luck and that TL simply uses a common "randomiser strategy" for generating a number, which will then determine what the outcome of the breeding will be. It's possible to implement far further going checks (like the amount of available gems, etc.) and other "seeding" criteria, but I doubt they would do so. They would certainly shoot themselves in the foot if THAT ever came out...

Cheers,
Olafo

Thanks for coming to look at my Forest. I too like to visit forests which are fully expanded with many animals. I admit is is a rare occurrence in this game.

It's not like they haven't shot themselves in the foot before. I cannot explain why I seem to be able to breed animals that others can't, or conversely, why it seemed to take forever to breed a Plantler well after everyone else was getting them as fails for other breedings. The best hypothesis I can come up with is luck. It is kind of like seeing those people who have won the largest lotteries four or five times, while I have won only twice in about five years of playing two cards a week, for a total of $2. I am lucky in FFS and unlucky in the lottery. I have to admit that I would rather win the Powerball ;-)

[RorJam]

My problem is lots fire/earth, nature/fire and earth/nature. Just don't understand why some are or were limited I feel that limited is a waste it could've been awesome but it was a super rare panda yippee lol. I Still feel we need new permanent elements. Myself personally I'm not a fan of the triple breed thing. Breed this then breed that then breed together, but that's something I have to deal with its not going to go away. Also Why have the Treent if we can't breed it? Just one example. I also feel we should be able to breed treasure to make more treasure. We got the charger battleground but I feel we should have more battlegrounds quarterly. Other than this I've stopped venting to tl. I did stop playing for a spell and tried DS and CS because it doesn't do anything to keep venting my frustrations and I'm not even sure if people agree or agreed with my past frustrations. I went to "greener pastures" which weren't that greener lol. So now I'm back since the last mini tourney at or around the last world event. I kept playing DS through their world event then stopped playing. I don't like gem traps but understand why they're there and the purpose of gem sales. I was a gem buyer and have bred an ultra rare the Ruby razorback that's it for gem but I've bred Retriever and money badger I was not smart and bought toucan should've kept trying but oh well. Honestly I've had up and down breeding I'll go a month with nothing new then I'll get a good string of luck. lately this week it's turned good I've bred lulibison then yesterday bred punk skunk my "new" account isn't as lucky though no ultra rares at all barely get any new animals but then my album on that account isn't as full so I get older animals then once and a while get a pretty new animal like talisama . I just try and keep my mouth shut these days and play or don't play it's easier since I've quit and come back for me to say" do I want this animal or that one, is this tourney one I want to win on both accounts or just this one, and more importantly do I want to buy this gem pack, animal or value pack" I don't feel the pressure anymore so it's more enjoyable than before even when my luck isn't great! Best of luck to all