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Thread: Making Sense of the Battleground

  1. #1
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    Making Sense of the Battlegrounds

    There are a few things that a true warrior needs to know about Fantasy Forest battles. A lot of players get confused about the significance of the "Strong Attack" "Weak Attack" or "Critical Hit" messages that appear when they tap the attack buttons. This guide will hopefully take away the confusion and mystery. Warning: It is LONG, and broken into sections in separate postings.

    1. SCORES I start with an overview of how your attack is scored because, ultimately, that's what determines your chance of winning. "Strong" "Weak" and "Critical" are NOT scores! We will get to what they mean to you later.

    2. HITS AND DAMAGE I describe the various types of hits and the damage they are capable of doing. This is one place where players are confusing the visual cues.

    3. DEFENSE I cover what works in your favor, aside from the obvious Critical Hit and Ultimate option.

    4. STANDARD HITS & RATINGS I address all that misleading stuff with "Strong Attack" and "Weak Attack" (another place where players are misreading visual cues). What does it really mean?

    5. CRITICAL THINKING I examine the event that seals the deal for most battles.

    6. ATTACK BUTTONS DEMYSTIFIED Which attack button to use? I explain what actually happens as you tap either the blue or purple attack buttons -- the commands they send to the system and how the game responds.

    7. THE NET ELEMENT BONUS I explain the role of the elements in your fighter selection and how they affect your score.

    8. UNIVERSAL FIGHTER SELECTOR I provide a tool that works in all Battleground regions and Arena Tournaments. The NEB was calculated for each responder type against every challenger type to create this tool.

    Please note that this guide does NOT claim to know the specific odds for any battle event, nor do I have data on the raw scores mapped to particular animals or to their elements, rarity or levels. TeamLava will never provide that information, and we don't actually NEED it to succeed at the battles. It is also unlikely that any TeamLava representative will ever verify or validate what I explain in this guide, although they are certainly welcome to do so.
    Last edited by SANDSCApe; 10-11-14 at 07:54 AM.
    It's perfectly okay to NOT know something; and one is no less worthy for admitting this. The wisest seeker is she who knows that she knows nothing!

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    Sections 1-2

    SCORES
    Your animal is given three separate quantitative scores, depending on how it matches up against the opponent. You get one score for the match-up of BOTH your elements against BOTH the opponent's elements. If yours are collectively stronger, you get bonus points; if weaker, you lose points. (See the Net Element Bonus for more details.)

    You get a second score for your animal's rarity versus the opponent's, and a third score for your animal's level versus the opponent's level. If your rarity or level are higher, you gain points in that category; if they are lower, you lose points.

    All three scores are combined and then mapped against specific odds for a Critical Hit. The higher your total score, the greater your chance of rolling a Critical Hit; the lower your total score, the less chance you have for a Critical.

    Please realize that your total score and, by extension, your odds for a Crit, are determined BEFORE YOU EVEN TOUCH AN ATTACK BUTTON. Your odds are based on your selection and calculated the instant you tap the BATTLE NOW button.

    The Critical Hit is important because of how much DAMAGE it does, but YOU DO NOT ABSOLUTELY NEED A CRITICAL HIT to win; you just can't lose once you get one.


    HITS AND DAMAGE
    There are FOUR TYPES OF HITS, each with its own range of DAMAGE:

    Ultimate Hit. Delivers 100% damage. How to get it: Just press the purple button on the right side of the attack screen and pay gems for instant GUARANTEED victory.

    Critical Hit. Delivers 50-100% damage. How to get it: Pick your best possible fighter and attack to secure your highest chance; then cross your fingers. You get the Crit purely by CHANCE; never guaranteed, but always possible.

    Standard Hit. Delivers 25-33% damage. This is what most of your attacks will do. You CAN WIN with only standard hits if you can manage to land four of them. How? I'll get to that later. You know you have a standard hit if it is rated "Strong Attack" or "Weak Attack" or even not rated at all.

    Incoming Hit. Delivers 20-49% damage to YOUR animal. This is what the opponent does on counter-attacks.

    You can assess the amount of damage each attack or counter-attack does by noting the incremental changes in the health meters of both animals.
    Last edited by SANDSCApe; 10-11-14 at 06:47 AM.
    It's perfectly okay to NOT know something; and one is no less worthy for admitting this. The wisest seeker is she who knows that she knows nothing!

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    Sections 3-4

    DEFENSE

    Notice that the range of the incoming hits is such that the opponent can never defeat you with less than 3 counter attacks, because the first two can do no more than 98% damage to your animal.

    Notice also that if the first two counter attacks fall within the 20-25% range, the third one will leave your animal standing. At this point, no matter what you do, your 4th attack will win the battle. This is how you can win without either an Ultimate or a Critical Hit. It is essentially a DEFENSIVE WIN; less about your own attacks and more about how your animal's elements (BOTH of them), rarity and level held up against the opponent's counter-attack. In fact, you can even get a defensive win with FOUR "WEAK" ATTACKS!

    If you select based only upon which element you are using to attack, then you may be losing out on the additional chance for victory offered by a defensively superior animal. The defensive win is by far my FAVORITE WAY TO WIN, because it doesn't just depend on a digital dice-roll; it's really your animal overpowering that opponent. YOU!

    As a form of encouragement perhaps, the regular Battleground challengers are handicapped at battle levels ending in 1 or 6 (...6, 11, 16, 21...), so players automatically get a defensive victory in those battles unless they roll a Critical.


    STANDARD HITS & RATINGS
    Since your standard hits deliver 25-33% damage, you cannot defeat the opponent with only 3 standard hits; whereas the opponent can wipe YOU out with 3 counter-attacks. Remember that any attack you make that is neither an Ultimate nor Critical Hit is a standard hit with that narrow range of damage. This is why your 3 "Strong" attacks can lose. They are standard, just like the "Weak" attacks.

    So what does "Weak Attack" or "Strong Attack" mean if they only appear when you're doing standard damage? Are they totally meaningless? No!

    The ratings of your attacks are not a quantitative score; they are qualitative. More to the point, they simply rate your attacking ELEMENT against the element combination of your opponent. A better label would be "Weak Element," "Strong Element," and really, that's how you should interpret it, keeping in mind that there are two other factors (rarity and levels of the two opposing animals) that also contribute to your chances of victory.

    The element ratings don't just pertain to your current battle. They serve as a BUILT-IN TUTORIAL so that you can make better choices on your rematch if you lose. They may also be telling you that you don't need to change a thing. If your element was strong against opponent X, use it again! The game also assumes that individual players may take notes and learn how a particular element fares against another element, the same element, or an element combination. It does NOT assume that we all come on the forum to take someone else's word for what is strong or weak against what.
    Last edited by SANDSCApe; 10-11-14 at 06:50 AM.
    It's perfectly okay to NOT know something; and one is no less worthy for admitting this. The wisest seeker is she who knows that she knows nothing!

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    Section 5

    CRITICAL THINKING
    Oddly enough, the most useless message on the battleground is the one we most want to see. "Critical Hit" does not tell you ANYTHING about your animal's strength or the quality of your chosen elements. Since even the worst choice has at least a minimal chance for a Crit, getting it does not indicate whether your animal had a high or low chance of getting it. All you know is you've got it! Yay!

    Its range of 50-100% damage can take out an opponent instantly, or may need to be combined with one or two other hits. Doesn't matter. You can't lose if you roll at least one Crit in a battle. Unless you have gems to splurge on the purple button, Crits are how you'll be getting most of your wins.

    Just remember that if you pick an animal with the best elements against your opponent and you match or surpass the rarity and level of the opponent, you have a relatively high chance of rolling a Crit; but it still is only a CHANCE, and never a 100% chance. The best can lose against the worst. Deal with it, because every now and then, that will actually work in your favor.
    Last edited by SANDSCApe; 10-11-14 at 06:54 AM.
    It's perfectly okay to NOT know something; and one is no less worthy for admitting this. The wisest seeker is she who knows that she knows nothing!

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    Sections 6-7

    ELEMENT BUTTONS DEMYSTIFIED
    I've re-examined the issue of the role of the primary/attacking element versus the secondary "unused" element when using a hybrid fighter. I think the fact that most of our standard hits get rated "weak" or "strong" has misled us into thinking that the attack choice matters, or that the "unused" element is weighed differently from the attacking element.

    I'm going to present evidence to dispel the notion that it matters which of your animal's element you use for attack. Moreover, I'm debunking the concept of a secondary or unused element.

    Premises:
    1. Outside of the Ultimate option, there are only two ways to win -- roll a Critical Hit or land 4 standard hits for a defensive victory.
    2. The chances for a Critical Hit are predetermined by your choice of fighter. Nothing you do during the battle can change those odds.
    3. The chances for a defensive victory are also dependent on your choice of fighter. Nothing you do during the battle can affect how much damage the opponent is doing.

    It therefore does not matter, once you have chosen your fighter and tapped the BATTLE NOW button, which of your fighter's elements you use because your attacks can only produce two results: standard damage of 25-33% or critical damage of 50-100%.

    Basically, the buttons you press during battle say the following things to the system:
    A. Ultimate button (purple): I don't want to roll the dice. Let me instantly do 100% damage in exchange for the stated gems. Play an extra cool destruction animation as I win.
    B. First element button (blue): I want to roll the dice based on the odds set by my animal versus your animal. Play the regular attack animation for this element. If I don't roll a Critical Hit, tell me how good this element is against your fighter.
    C. Second element button (blue), if your animal is a hybrid: I want to roll the dice based on the odds set by my animal versus your animal. Play the regular attack animation for this element. If I don't roll a Critical Hit, tell me how good this element is against your fighter.
    The system will then faithfully obey your commands.

    THE NET ELEMENT BONUS
    So it's all about the fighter selection, if you're going for the dice roll. THERE IS NO UNUSED ELEMENT! What you need to aim for with elements is what I call the Net Element Bonus (NEB). Add 1 point for each strength and minus one point for each weakness. The total will be your NEB.
    If your fighter has 2 strong elements and no weak, NEB is 2.
    2 strong and 1 weak is a NEB of 1.
    1 strong and 1 weak is a NEB of zero.
    1 strong and 2 weak is a NEB of -1.
    2 weak and no strong is a NEB of -2.
    Match up each of your fighter's elements against BOTH of the opponent's elements to calculate your NEB. You must determine for yourself the best way to maximize NEB, rarity and level.
    Last edited by SANDSCApe; 10-11-14 at 07:19 AM.
    It's perfectly okay to NOT know something; and one is no less worthy for admitting this. The wisest seeker is she who knows that she knows nothing!

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    Section 8

    UNIVERSAL FIGHTER SELECTOR
    Search for the line that begins with the challenger's elemental Type, then select the highest rarity and level you have from the recommended responder types. Elements matter more than rarity. Rarity matters more than level.
    See the bottom of the post for notes that may help you use the Selector.

    Pure Gem: Use Electric-Dark, Dark-Water or Dark-Fire. <DARK>

    Gem-Nature: Use Gem-Fire or Dark-Fire

    Gem-Fire: Use Electric-Water, Dark-Water, Water-Earth or Water-Fire <WATER>


    Pure Electric: Use Electric-Earth, Dark-Earth, Earth-Nature or Earth-Fire <EARTH>

    Electric-Dark: Use Earth-Fire

    Electric-Water: Use Electric-Earth

    Electric-Earth: Use Gem-Nature or Earth-Nature

    Electric-Nature: Use Gem-Fire!! Second-best responders are Pure Gem, Gem-Nature, Electric-Fire, Dark-Fire, Earth-Fire or Nature-Fire <GEM> <FIRE>

    Electric-Fire: Use Electric-Earth or Earth-Fire <EARTH>

    Pure Dark: Use Electric-Fire, Dark-Fire, Earth-Fire, or Nature-Fire <FIRE>

    Dark-Water: Use Electric-Dark, Electric-Water, Electric-Earth. Electric-Nature or Electric-Fire <ELECTRIC>

    Dark-Earth: Use Gem-Nature, Dark-Nature, Water-Nature, Earth-Nature or Nature-Fire. <NATURE>

    Dark-Nature: Use Gem-Fire, Electric-Fire, Dark-Fire, Water-Fire or Nature-Fire <FIRE>

    Dark-Fire: Use Water-Earth, Water-Fire or Earth-Fire

    Pure Water: Use Electric-Dark, Electric-Water, Electric-Earth or Electric-Nature <ELECTRIC>

    Water-Earth: Use Gem-Nature. Second-best responders are Pure Gem, Electric-Nature, Dark-Nature, Water-Nature or Earth-Nature <GEM> <NATURE>

    Water-Nature: use Pure Gem, Gem-Nature, Gem-Fire, Electric-Dark, Electric-Water, Electric-Nature or Electric-Fire. <GEM> <ELECTRIC>

    Water-Fire: use Electric-Water, Electric-Earth or Water-Earth

    Pure Earth: Use Gem-Nature. Second-best responders are Pure Gem, Dark-Nature, Water-Nature or Earth-Nature. <GEM> <NATURE>


    Earth-Nature: Use Gem-Nature!!! Second-best responders are Gem-Fire or Pure Gem. Third-best responders are Dark-Nature, Water-Nature or Nature-Fire <GEM> <NATURE>

    Earth-Fire: Use Water-Earth

    Pure Nature: Use Gem-Fire!! Second-best responders are Pure Gem, Gem-Nature, Electric-Fire, Dark-Fire, Water-Fire or Nature-Fire <GEM> <FIRE>

    Nature-Fire: Use Gem-Fire or Water-Fire!! Second-best responders are Pure Gem, Electric-Water, Electric-Fire, Water-Earth or Earth-Fire. <GEM> <FIRE> <WATER>

    Pure Fire: Use Water-Earth


    NOTES

    Sections in red text have been updated for the introduction of Water-Fire and Gem-Fire hybrids.
    Sections in blue text were adjusted for Gem's dominance over Earth & Nature.

    Dominance: Indicated inside the <POINTED BRACKETS> whenever responders have at least one element that is neutral or weak against the challenger. If no dominant element is indicated, ALL the responders' elements are strong against the challenger. E.g., against Dark-Fire, WATER, EARTH and FIRE are ALL dominant. In such cases, if you don't have a super with two dominant elements, use a corresponding rare; otherwise, select a super with just one of the dominant elements.

    Selection Example: If the challenger is Glider, Daredevil or Lion, look for Electric-Fire in the Selector. Recommended responders are Electric-Earth or Earth-Fire, and EARTH is the dominant element. If you don't have Terradactyl or Magmacore, you would use Mammoth, Volcamel or Rampage. If you have neither the supers nor rares for this set of responders, you are better off going with a super EARTH like Gargolem, Griffin, Grassquatch or Sloth. Try not to use Shock Fox, Armordillo or Rhino unless the challenger is the common Glider. The dominant element is indicated so that you can pick the next best SUPER- or ULTRA-rare if you don't have the best.

    Winning: Once you select your fighter and enter the battle, your odds are SET, and it won't matter which element button you use. If you don't roll a Critical, your hit will do standard damage of 25-33% from EITHER element button. If the opponent lands at least 2 weak hits (20-25% each), your animal will survive the 3rd counter-attack and get a defensive default victory. Your 4th hit ALWAYS wins, if you get one, even if you don't get a Critical.
    Last edited by SANDSCApe; 11-08-14 at 08:02 PM.
    It's perfectly okay to NOT know something; and one is no less worthy for admitting this. The wisest seeker is she who knows that she knows nothing!

  7. #7
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    Great work sand!!
    Main id: squinn1981

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    THANKS, Sand!

    Question: Let's assume that you always pick an animal that has one element that is strong vs. an opponent's element, and is also not weak to the opponent's other element. And that strong element is the one you will attack with. But you want to use a rare or super-rare to increase your odds (this is for all of us who have no ultra rares), and to do that, you must choose an animal that has 2 elements. Now, assuming your element 1 is strong, are you better off with an animal whose element 2 is both strong and weak to the opponent? Or are you better off with an element 2 that is neutral? This I have always really wondered. I tend to go with the latter - always a strong + a neutral element, assuming that that is better for defense. But I am wondering if all your studies can tell me if I'd be better off with a strong + a strong/weak element animal.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by zenobia42 View Post
    THANKS, Sand!

    Question: Let's assume that you always pick an animal that has one element that is strong vs. an opponent's element, and is also not weak to the opponent's other element. And that strong element is the one you will attack with. But you want to use a rare or super-rare to increase your odds (this is for all of us who have no ultra rares), and to do that, you must choose an animal that has 2 elements. Now, assuming your element 1 is strong, are you better off with an animal whose element 2 is both strong and weak to the opponent? Or are you better off with an element 2 that is neutral? This I have always really wondered. I tend to go with the latter - always a strong + a neutral element, assuming that that is better for defense. But I am wondering if all your studies can tell me if I'd be better off with a strong + a strong/weak element animal.
    SEE MY 09-20-2014 POST FOR WHAT I BELIEVE IS A BETTER RESPONSE THAN THE ONE BELOW.

    Gosh, turn your brain off! Why do you have to ask the thinking questions? LOL -- People are gonna think we're mad.

    (Assuming that you can't get the second element as strong as the first and still score high on rarity & level) whether it is better for the second element to be weak against one but strong against the other of the opponent's combo; or neutral against both is difficult to work out. But to be sure, TL has worked it out and if you're willing, you can test the questionable element and see how they flag it. Not that you actually WANT to attack with that element, but you may try it to see how it measures up.

    But if you already know the strength of the second element and know you won't attack with it, then you can assess it defensively. Look to see whether the opponent is taking small chunks off your health or stomping you down to like half-way on the meter with the first counter-attack. I wouldn't sweat it. We get far more wins from Crits than we do with defensive victories.

    If I had to call it from scratch, I'd agree with you and go with the neutral 2nd element rather than weak-n-strong: present no weakness to the opponent. Also consider whether you would attack YOUR animal with theirs.

    I wish I kept decent defensive notes, but I've mostly been experimenting with how Dark, Electric & Gem square off against different combos. Rather annoying that the system mostly doesn't flag them at all.
    Last edited by SANDSCApe; 09-21-14 at 04:04 AM.
    It's perfectly okay to NOT know something; and one is no less worthy for admitting this. The wisest seeker is she who knows that she knows nothing!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by SANDSCApe View Post
    Gosh, turn your brain off! Why do you have to ask the thinking questions? LOL -- People are gonna think we're mad.

    (Assuming that you can't get the second element as strong as the first and still score high on rarity & level) whether it is better for the second element to be weak against one but strong against the other of the opponent's combo; or neutral against both is difficult to work out. But to be sure, TL has worked it out and if you're willing, you can test the questionable element and see how they flag it. Not that you actually WANT to attack with that element, but you may try it to see how it measures up.

    But if you already know the strength of the second element and know you won't attack with it, then you can assess it defensively. Look to see whether the opponent is taking small chunks off your health or stomping you down to like half-way on the meter with the first counter-attack. I wouldn't sweat it. We get far more wins from Crits than we do with defensive victories.

    If I had to call it from scratch, I'd agree with you and go with the neutral 2nd element rather than weak-n-strong: present no weakness to the opponent. Also consider whether you would attack YOUR animal with theirs.

    I wish I kept decent defensive notes, but I've mostly been experimenting with how Dark, Electric & Gem square off against different combos. Rather annoying that the system mostly doesn't flag them at all.
    Believe you me, sometimes I wish I could! lol

    I think it's too late to avoid people thinking I am insane, but there may be hope for you.

    As for gem animals, I know nothing at all about the attack end of those match-ups. So can you confirm: is gem is strong attack on everything but dark (or everything but dark and another gem)? Or is it only strong vs. select other elements and if so, which ones? If you didn't notice, no worries. I ask only because it is something I cannot check myself.

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